Technology Liberation Front - Latest Comments in A Note to Ron Paul Activists

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

probabilityzero — Mon, 17 Dec 2007 16:14:25 -0000

I completely agree. What the Ron Paul supporters are doing is spamming.

It's especially entertaining when there's a backlash to their spam, like there was on Digg a while ago, and they immediately claim censorship and blame it on government agencies.

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

bolatano — Sun, 09 Dec 2007 15:04:53 -0000

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

Fed Up — Fri, 07 Dec 2007 17:26:12 -0000

Hi, I am just one of the irritated people who might otherwise be sympathetic to the Ron Paul message.

Pardon me for naming what I am about to name. When I say "Internet terrorism", I tried to think about a better way to put it for days, and reluctantly find myself lacking a better name for what it is. I am flabbergasted by not having seen anything like this before.

I was at the least, indifferent and undecided to all candidates before. I now hate Ron Paul with every fiber of my being, and 100% of the reason why is because I work online and have to put up with the campaign of Internet terrorism perpetrated by his supporters - for going on six months, now. Merry Christmas.

It's a little late to do anything about it now. RP went past "credible", through "dubious", "unlikely", and "slim", to "snowball's chance in a very hot place", all in the space of a few months, thanks to the zealots. We now no more dare to allow RP to get elected than we dare give Al Quaeda control of the White House. If we vote for Ron Paul, we will send the message that spam, harassment, and threats work and are a viable way to get your candidate into office.

Sadly, the monopolization of all online discussion by the fanatics ensure that they have no source of reality left except to get a contact buzz off of each other's mania, and so all that I - or the original blog author - can say and do won't be heard by the people who need to hear it.

The best hope we have is that we can have the Internet back some time around 2010, after the last RonPaulian has shivered through the withdrawals.

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

PAFreedom — Sat, 10 Nov 2007 21:18:37 -0000

Great blog, we need a return to civility. Dr. Ron Paul of all people exemplifies manners and we need to follow suit.

The facts are on our side, we don't need to turn people off when we have the high ground of ideas.

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

Gary McGath — Thu, 08 Nov 2007 13:37:49 -0000

I don't think I'd completely believed it till I saw the comments on this blog entry. Clearly Ron Paul has acquired a significant number of "supporters" who exhibit the worst sort of paranoia and think that the way to win support is to attack anyone who criticizes them for doing that.

Hey, maybe I should criticize them on my blog. It looks as if it's a great way to get a readership boost. :)

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

Marc Scott Emery — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 22:53:50 -0000

I have to agree that Ron Paul critics, even ones like this $50 fair weather friend, are far more annoying and obnoxious than Ron Paul fans.

Why hold us responsible for an act of minor impact spamming that could easily have been done by other candidate's dirty tricks?

Candidly, you have no idea what attracts people to Paul's campaign if you believe it is anything but Ron Paul's words & integrity, faithfulness to the Constitution, his principles.

I noticed that $4.2 million sure stopped the bogus pronouncements of bloggers and techno-media (Wired, etc) about spambots and the Paul campaign.

Clearly, spam can't contribute 4.2 million. 37,000+ donors on ONE DAY are real.

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

VAT — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 16:57:00 -0000

We have seen how MSM has used propaganda, “bumper sticker slogans”, and fancy visuals to influence the American people into believing into many things; from illegal wars, to unwarranted searches, free speech zones, torture, fair elections, NCLB and “Mission Accomplished”. We are now seeing the same mechanism being used against Ron Paul and his supporters.
If the MSM can say it enough that Ron Paul is a “Long shot” his supporters are “fanatical”, “Hippies”, “kooks” and so on then the American people will certainly follow suit and be satisfactory indoctrinated into believing this. Then Ron Paul’s message is not heard because nobody wants to be a “nut”! Americans have proven themselves to fall for the indoctrination and I think the anti-Ron Paul posters on sites like wired are a testament to this.
I think that the Ron Paul supporters who act inappropriate on threads are frustrated at being unfairly labeled. We are not hippies, living in our mom’s basement, pot smoking, gun-owning, conspiracy theorists, gun holding, geeks, and neo-Nazis. When an anti-Ron Paul person stated that his supporters should be used by Muslim men as goats, at wired; why is it not considered kooky or extreme. When the anti-Ron Paul elements simply pop into threads to degrade without any substance to their non-argument then it is okay?
I think many of our youth have been highly motivated by the terror we have experienced under this eight years of neoconservative rule. They want better for themselves in America and they know that Ron Paul is the real deal. They have dedicated their time, talents and energy into making America a better place and want an honest government. When they encounter people on-line that simply degrade them in addition to a media that discounts them then they get frustrated and lash out. They are young and will learn better ways of dealing with others. But at least they are not apathetic to their own future in America. At least they are wise to what is happening in our society. At least they are trying to make a difference for the better. But just because a few people are inappropriate on a thread, it does not mean that all of Ron Paul supporters are crazy or that Ron Paul’s message should not be listened to as an authentic, very intelligent message of hope and change.
We can become a great nation again. We can have a government for the people again. “Anything is possible“, is the message our youth and Ron Paul. I agree. There will be bumps along the way as America hopefully takes their rightful place back in the world and as the enthusiastic youth who support Ron Paul grow into adulthood. But do not label a man, Ron Paul, and his entire group. Do not let MSM indoctrinate you. Think out side the box. America is going through growing pains as are some of Ron Paul supporters. In addition, do not neglect to notice the inappropriate behaviors of the anti-Ron Paul posters on comment threads.
Sorry to ramble. It is frustrating for us old kids too.

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

Eugen Leitl — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 14:16:36 -0000

The comments are priceless, indeed. When Ron Paul has supporters like that, who needs enemies?

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

Chris F — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 11:20:57 -0000

Hi Tim,

You are exactly right. I, too, am a Ron Paul supporter and have seen many comments that ceratinly do not do the man proud. If the early Christians tried to spread The Word the way some of my fellow RPer's are, Christianity would have gone the way of Zoroastrianism.

I think the first rule we ned to follow would be similar to the Hippocratic Oath: 'Do no harm.' We need to ask ourselves when we reply to negative statements made about Dr. Paul: Can we do it without insulting the writer(s) personally? Will what we say bring anyone into the fold, or just piss someone off? We must do a better job of focusing on the issue being discussed, the way 'Fluffy' does in her reply above. Saying someone 'sounds like a douche bag' not only insults the writer, but makes it less likely that anyone who reads what you have to say will take you (or Rep. Paul) seriously.

Peace be with you.

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

busta — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 10:20:10 -0000

To tim lee,

I apologize for my previous comments on your article. I was reading another Ron Paul supporter blast article and somehow typed my comment on your site. Sorry for this mix up I didn't realize this until I re-read the article again above my comments. Oops and once again, I apologize. I guess I have to dig up that other article and give them a piece of my mind. -busta

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

John Howard — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 08:57:11 -0000

The idea that Ron Paul supporters are generally more rude or irritating than the anti-Paul bloggers, "journalists", or commenters is pure myth. What is irritating about Ron Paul supporters is that they are so numerous. That scares people who thought they understood the whole world, but didn't. I read the comment section to many blogs each day and I am convinced that the anti-Paul forces are, by far, the more insulting, dishonest and irritating. But they aren't as numerous.

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

busta — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 08:29:44 -0000

oh yes, I forgot to ask. Which big government, neo-conservative, gun taking, war mongering, tax laying, lying, thief, on either the dem. or rep. side are you going to vote for? Why dont you write an article about who we as "Paulites" have any other choice to vote for??? There is not another candidate worth any vote of mine. Unless you just want more of the same distrust you have in government as you do right now.

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

busta — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 08:20:46 -0000

Your article just shows that, not only do you cut down REAL AMERICANS that support this man for the message of maintaining freedom and liberty that is slipping away in this country, but you also are cutting down ALL the VFW members nationally that have now endorsed Ron Paul, and also, the military members and their families that have contributed the MOST donations to Ron Paul's campaign than any other candidate. OH and did I mention pretty much every gun owner that hears Ron Paul's message and his stance on protecting the constitution and the 2nd amendment. So choose wisely what you say, you are talking about a lot of people, Americans, that actually give a damn about what their children are going to deal with for the rest of their lives.

So, watch it next time, because you sound like a douche bag!

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

Luis — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 01:15:03 -0000

Congratulations, Tim, you've been promoted to the MSM. I never knew you were pro-North American Union, though.

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

Jacob — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 00:35:29 -0000

You know, you may have distaste for me, but it is nothing compared to my distaste for the MSM propaganda and yr blog actually. In fact, since you can't attack Dr. Paul with any force, you resort to going after the supporters. What a coward.

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

Don Marti — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 23:49:22 -0000

Kind of reminds me of the "Linux Possibly Defamed Somewhere" phenomenon.

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

Jim Harper — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 22:17:39 -0000

Thanks for sharing your thinking, Fluffy. I know my own practice with people that can't be persuaded is to move on, if for no other reason than because talking to them is a waste of my time.

There may be an exception, but flame wars almost never change anyone's mind. What they do is make both participants look bad to outside observers, including the person who might have been persuaded to consider the value of Ron Paul's views but who is alienated by the ugliness of the argument.

I don't think you personally need this advice - you've already proven yourself thoughtful and polite. But perhaps other Ron Paul supporters like "brody" and "Jim Kelly" do. They might as well be, and may actually be, opponents of Mr. Paul. Their manners give credibilty to posts like the one by Michael Pugliese. His is a simple form of ad hominem attack called "Poisoning the Well," but "brody" and "Jim Kelly" make it a lot easier for him to do it. Too bad.

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

Golden — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 22:07:19 -0000

so shouldnt you be happy people are registering for your site?

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

Fluffy — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 21:56:12 -0000

Jim, I post on many sites. Most of them are purely political, although some aren't.

There are sites where I am on my best behavior, and sites where I am not.

My criteria for deciding when to bring the flamethrower out is pretty basic: if it's plain that I'm dealing with a hater who could never be persuaded anyway, I will flame away without remorse.

Many Paul supporters have this fantasy of rescue, where just because they're nice and polite to some junior Hannity, they melt all the hatred away and all the neocons in the world are morally redeemed. That's just not going to happen, no matter how many flowers you stick into guns. There are many people who are possible Paul converts: older "East Coast Establishment" Republicans, Independents, antiwar Democrats who don't trust their own party any more, religious conservatives [of the homeschooler variety, and not really of the Dobson or Gary Bauer variety], economic conservatives, disillusioned veterans, etc. But Freepers are never, ever, ever going to be convinced, and neither are most Townhallers or RedStaters. There's really no appropriate mechanism for interacting with them other than with flames. Politeness will just be interpreted as weakness. That's the way all their heroes act, so that's the way they will act.

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

Jim Harper — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 21:29:41 -0000

This is fascinating!

I think most of us TLFers, most having worked in Washington, D.C., recognize that persuading people starts with courtesy and respect. I've been assuming, as I think Tim does, that Ron Paul's supporters want to persuade others to join their cause - but maybe that's not the case.

Would anyone who has posted incendiary comments here, or on any other blog or site, care to explain what motivates you? Are you a genuine Paul supporter who also believes it is good to alienate others from supporting him? Why is that a good thing to do?

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

FreedomJoyAdventure — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 21:25:17 -0000

Sarah 'Lie' Stirland at Wired has been writing some really nasty, disingenuous slanted stuff against Ron Paul. And she's still doing it.

Those of us who support Ron Paul have been putting up with loads of BS for a long time now. I wouldn't expect much tolerance.

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

Jim Kelly — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 20:55:36 -0000

I would rather have bad manners than be a neocon-loving PRO-WAR, PRO-NORTH AMERICAN UNION asshole traitor, like yourself.

So FUCK YOU.

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

badmedia — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 20:46:50 -0000

If you write false things, you should honestly expect such responses. And if you want to start highlighting crazy's, lets start with people who want to nuke any arab in the world, who do you think they support? But you don't see many Ron Paul supporters going there. Why? Because we don't have to, the message is good enough on it's own.

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

Michael Pugliese — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 19:55:23 -0000

Neo-Nazi Support for Ron Paul
http://adamholland.blogspot...

Re: A Note to Ron Paul Activists

Fluffy — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 19:33:19 -0000

People were angry about the Wired story because of the dishonest way in which the story was written.

The story said, essentially, "Many people have claimed that Ron Paul doesn't really have any supporters, and that his apparent online popularity is being faked. That was proven to be true today when email spam was uncovered that had apparently been sent by a botnet."

People naturally respond badly to being told they don't exist, and are merely a figment of some botnet criminal's joke.

It was a ragingly dishonest claim, because of the fundamental limits of what can be done by a botnet. A botnet simply CAN'T scan the blogosphere and swarm anti-Paul blogs with pro-Paul context-specific comments. It can't be done, and the writers at Wired KNEW that and chose to lie. So they got complaints. Those are the breaks.